Texas3006 Forum

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 7:28 pm

Bitter Clinger wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 7:12 pm Paxton is right on, but the Plano Chief of Police appears to be a BLM sympathizer. As things begin to escalate I doubt residents will agree with his appeasement approach.

I will repeat that I disagree with the BLM organization, and I believe the movement is based on a lie.

I have little issue with the chief walking with protestors in the street in order to maintain peace and prevent them from obstructing traffic. I will agree that it can be bad optics, but to me, that epitomizes the term "peace officer". But he needs to be careful not to show favoritism to one side, especially when that side has publicly come out in support of abolishing policing in general (among other things).

No. Our Police Chief is a bigoted racist scum! he needs to be replaced immediately!

03Lightningrocks wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:01 pm

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 7:28 pm

Bitter Clinger wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 7:12 pm Paxton is right on, but the Plano Chief of Police appears to be a BLM sympathizer. As things begin to escalate I doubt residents will agree with his appeasement approach.

I will repeat that I disagree with the BLM organization, and I believe the movement is based on a lie.

I have little issue with the chief walking with protestors in the street in order to maintain peace and prevent them from obstructing traffic. I will agree that it can be bad optics, but to me, that epitomizes the term "peace officer". But he needs to be careful not to show favoritism to one side, especially when that side has publicly come out in support of abolishing policing in general (among other things).

No. Our Police Chief is a bigoted racist scum! he needs to be replaced immediately!

Even city council has no direct influence in the hiring/firing of the police chief. That is left to the city manager, which is one of the few positions the city council DOES directly appoint.

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:20 pm

03Lightningrocks wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:01 pm

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 7:28 pm

I will repeat that I disagree with the BLM organization, and I believe the movement is based on a lie.

I have little issue with the chief walking with protestors in the street in order to maintain peace and prevent them from obstructing traffic. I will agree that it can be bad optics, but to me, that epitomizes the term "peace officer". But he needs to be careful not to show favoritism to one side, especially when that side has publicly come out in support of abolishing policing in general (among other things).

No. Our Police Chief is a bigoted racist scum! he needs to be replaced immediately!

Even city council has no direct influence in the hiring/firing of the police chief. That is left to the city manager, which is one of the few positions the city council DOES directly appoint.

Good argument for looking at changing city government to a strong mayor model, where an elected official answerable to taxpaying citizens makes the decisions, and not some overpaid non-elected career beauracrat.

Bitter Clinger wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 6:35 am

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:20 pm

03Lightningrocks wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:01 pm

No. Our Police Chief is a bigoted racist scum! he needs to be replaced immediately!

Even city council has no direct influence in the hiring/firing of the police chief. That is left to the city manager, which is one of the few positions the city council DOES directly appoint.

Good argument for looking at changing city government to a strong mayor model, where an elected official answerable to taxpaying citizens makes the decisions, and not some overpaid non-elected career beauracrat.

That would likely require changing the jobs of council and mayor from part time jobs to full time positions. The idea of going from 1 full time city manager (employee) who answers to 8 elected part time city council members to 8 elected full time city council members is something I'd have to think about.

The other issue is we're having trouble right now in Plano holding onto 50% conservative representation on the council; something we only achieved 2 years ago. The political left has realized that starting in school board and other municipal elections, you can gain more influence at the local level and grow from there. Sadly, many folks on the political right are apathetic or too ignorant to vote in municipal/school elections. As a result, I don't think changing the model of our city government would change much.

Flightmare wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 5:49 pm

Bitter Clinger wrote: ↑Tue May 11, 2021 6:35 am

Flightmare wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 10:20 pm

Even city council has no direct influence in the hiring/firing of the police chief. That is left to the city manager, which is one of the few positions the city council DOES directly appoint.

Good argument for looking at changing city government to a strong mayor model, where an elected official answerable to taxpaying citizens makes the decisions, and not some overpaid non-elected career beauracrat.

That would likely require changing the jobs of council and mayor from part time jobs to full time positions. The idea of going from 1 full time city manager (employee) who answers to 8 elected part time city council members to 8 elected full time city council members is something I'd have to think about.

The other issue is we're having trouble right now in Plano holding onto 50% conservative representation on the council; something we only achieved 2 years ago. The political left has realized that starting in school board and other municipal elections, you can gain more influence at the local level and grow from there. Sadly, many folks on the political right are apathetic or too ignorant to vote in municipal/school elections. As a result, I don't think changing the model of our city government would change much.

Understood, however in Dallas we have an unelected career beauracrat city manager making $450k / year and decisions that do not reflect what much of the electorate wants. His last Police Chief hire was a dismal failure, new one yet to be tested. Infrastructure crumbling and homeless are out of control and yet we see little to no improvement. Sometimes change is good. Our current mayor is turning out to be much better than the last and is clearly up to the task.

Bitter Clinger wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 2:13 pm He didn't strike her, he knocked her phone out of her hand. If he wanted to strike someone to cause bodily harm, he could have easily done so. It was a target rich environment. Had Plano police enforced the law to begin with, the incident never would have happened. So disappointing. This guy is a hero is n my book!

This is something that more people need to understand. In Texas, an assault does not have to include physical contact. It can be threats made either verbally or by gestures. Even more important, an assault that includes contact is illegal and a crime if the contact is offensive. So, it is possible to charge him for assault without his striking her. And since he did strike her, at least in the hand, it is an assault with contact (I am sure most of us agree we would be offended if someone knocked our phone out of our hand). This is a class C misdemeanor, with punishment just a little more severe than a traffic ticket (max of $500 fine).

But even worse, is that an assault which causes simple bodily injury is a class A misdemeanor punishable by a year in jail. And the definition of bodily injury includes just feeling pain. If you hit someone and the say ouch or tell the officer that it hurt them, you will be charged with assault bodily injury. He got lucky that the woman did not think to say that it hurt, so he only got charged with assault by contact.

His possible defense, if this goes to court, is that he was justified under the Penal Code in defending himself. This is where knowing the law would work for him as much as it did against him above. Under the Penal Code, you can use force but not deadly force to prevent someone else from using unlawful force on you. The group, including the woman who was hit, was illegally (as in committing an offense under Section 20.02 of the Penal Code) restraining the male, along with everyone else they blocked in, through force or intimidation. That makes trying to move them out of the way self-defense. And if you want to stretch it (which is not good tactics for a court case), you can argue that their restraint was deadly force (in the manner of its use, it could cause death or serious bodily injury, say if the traffic blockage tied up an ambulance with a passenger in it who needed immediate treatment). That would have justified his shooting as many of them as needed to clear the intersection. Again, I do not recommend trying this as it is a real stretch.

And since I am stretching the law, I should point out I am not a lawyer and none of this is legal advice. It is my lay opinion of the Texas law and you should always read the law for yourself before taking any actions, even if a real lawyer does give you advice. That was the original point of the post, that we need to read the law before we say any reported actions were or were not illegal.

All well and good. Facts remain that the intersection was illegally blocked by people wearing helmets and body armor and who brandished what appeared to be a weapon. Police should have done their job. Do they have standing orders to "go easy" on these BLM agitators?

I wonder how quickly we would be arrested if we pointed tasers as the city council or any police officer in Plano?

jason812 wrote: ↑Wed May 12, 2021 9:15 am I wonder how quickly we would be arrested if we pointed tasers as the city council or any police officer in Plano?

If you are black, it's no problem. The cop would go to jail if he shot you.

jason812 wrote: ↑Mon May 10, 2021 1:47 pm If the rioters were breaking the law, how can an action against them be against the law?

Speeding is breaking the law; it's a Class C misdemeanor.

You can't shoot someone for speeding.